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Can a starter be rebuilt?

 
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Mad Scientist

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Since: Jul 07, 2003
Posts: 13



(Msg. 1) Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 10:32 pm
Post subject: Can a starter be rebuilt?
Archived from groups: rec>motorcycles (more info?)

I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point it
doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a new,
fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but the
engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The model
was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
question.

1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive

Thanks,
mad scientist

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Ken Ishiguro

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Since: Jul 25, 2003
Posts: 37



(Msg. 2) Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:20 pm
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"Mad Scientist" wrote in message

 > Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The model
 > was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
 > question.
 >
 > 1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive
 >
Knowing how Kawi does things, your starter probably fits many different
models. Check <a rel="nofollow" style='text-decoration: none;' href="http://www.buykawasaki.com" target="_blank">http://www.buykawasaki.com</a> and look up your model. Once you
know the P/N, you can look at other models to see if they use the same
starter. I would be willing to bet the problem is worn motor brushes
(probably spring-loaded graphite blocks). If that's the problem, the Kawi
dealer may have rebuild kits.

Ken Ishiguro

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emore1

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Since: Jun 20, 2003
Posts: 406



(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 12:37 am
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Mad Scientist wrote:
 > I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point it
 > doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a new,
 > fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but the
 > engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
 > up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
 > started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
 > starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one?

It *can* be rebuilt. Sometimes, it's tough to find someone qualified
AND willing to do it.

The model
 > was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
 > question.

I would imagine that the starter itself was used on several models for
more than two years. It may not be as scarce as you think. Good luck.

Emore

 >
 > 1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive
 >
 > Thanks,
 > mad scientist
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Thomas Muffaletto

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Since: Apr 04, 2004
Posts: 31



(Msg. 4) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:19 am
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"Mad Scientist" wrote in message

 > I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point it
 > doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a new,
 > fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but the
 > engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
 > up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
 > started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
 > starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The model
 > was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
 > question.
 >
 > 1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive
 >
 > Thanks,
 > mad scientist

im sure you can but will it be cost affective.
I rebuilt a few car starters - its pretty easy
if you have the parts.
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Timberwoof1

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Since: Jul 02, 2003
Posts: 1466



(Msg. 5) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:43 am
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In article ,
Mad Scientist <the_rog.TakeThisOut@garbage.yahoo.com> wrote:

 > I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point it
 > doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a new,
 > fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but the
 > engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
 > up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
 > started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
 > starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The model
 > was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
 > question.
 >
 > 1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive
 >
 > Thanks,
 > mad scientist

12 volts is low for a battery. Are the battery terminals nice and clean?
What's the system voltage when the bike runs?

The starter could be rebuilt. You start with the brushes, which may need
replacing. If you have to rewind the coils, then it may be worthwhile
trying to find another one.

--
Timberwoof <me at timberwoof dot com>
faq: <a rel="nofollow" style='text-decoration: none;' href="http://www.timberwoof.com/motorcycle/faq.shtml" target="_blank">http://www.timberwoof.com/motorcycle/faq.shtml</a>
bike: <a rel="nofollow" style='text-decoration: none;' href="http://www.timberwoof.com/motorcycle" target="_blank">http://www.timberwoof.com/motorcycle</a>
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Mad Scientist

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Since: Jul 07, 2003
Posts: 13



(Msg. 6) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:43 am
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Timberwoof wrote:



 >
 >
  >>I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point it
  >>doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a new,
  >>fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but the
  >>engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
  >>up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
  >>started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
  >>starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The model
  >>was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
  >>question.
  >>
  >>1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive
  >>
  >>Thanks,
  >>mad scientist
 >
 >
 > 12 volts is low for a battery. Are the battery terminals nice and clean?
 > What's the system voltage when the bike runs?
 >
 > The starter could be rebuilt. You start with the brushes, which may need
 > replacing. If you have to rewind the coils, then it may be worthwhile
 > trying to find another one.
 >

Terminals are clean. At 3500rpm, there is 13.x volts at the battery.
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Robert Bolton

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Since: Dec 11, 2003
Posts: 862



(Msg. 7) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:43 am
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"Mad Scientist" wrote in message

 >
 >
 > Timberwoof wrote:
 >


  > >
  > >
   > >>I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point
it
   > >>doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a
new,
   > >>fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but
the
   > >>engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter.
Hooked
   > >>up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
   > >>started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
   > >>starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The
model
   > >>was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of
the
   > >>question.
   > >>
   > >>1984 Kawasaki 700 LTD Shaft drive
   > >>
   > >>Thanks,
   > >>mad scientist
  > >
  > >
  > > 12 volts is low for a battery. Are the battery terminals nice and
clean?
  > > What's the system voltage when the bike runs?
  > >
  > > The starter could be rebuilt. You start with the brushes, which may
need
  > > replacing. If you have to rewind the coils, then it may be
worthwhile
  > > trying to find another one.
  > >
 >
 > Terminals are clean. At 3500rpm, there is 13.x volts at the battery.

Bad starter relay? Loose connection that breaks under load? Try
connecting a jumper cable onto the battery's positive terminal and touch
it to the starter's terminal for a second and see what happens.

Probably a bad starter but you never know...

Robert
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bob prohaska

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Since: Aug 05, 2003
Posts: 151



(Msg. 8) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 7:40 am
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Mad Scientist wrote:
 > engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
 > up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the

That particular measurement won't tell you anything useful.

Much better to test under load: Measure the voltage at the starter terminal
with all wires connected: Battery voltage with no crank implies an open starter,
probably brushes; easy to fix.

If you get low voltage check the battery while trying to crank. Battery
posts, bolts and cable lugs should be measured individually, as any can
have a bad connection. Check on both sides of the starter relay.

Finally, there's a slim chance of a shorted starter. That will be hard to
find without a high-current ammeter and a knowledge of the starter's stall
current rating.

hth,

bob p
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Tony D

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Since: Jan 31, 2004
Posts: 574



(Msg. 9) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 12:36 pm
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"Mad Scientist" wrote in message

 > I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the point it
 > doesn't even try to turn the engine. Just for grins, I installed a new,
 > fully charged battery. Like before, the starter relay clicks but the
 > engine doesn't turn. I pulled the started wire off the starter. Hooked
 > up to a voltmeter, it shows 12 volts. This leads me to think the
 > started is completely screwed as voltage is being dumped into the
 > starter. Can it be rebuilt or do I need to get a new one? The model
 > was only built for 2 years, so methinks finding a used one is out of the
 > question.

Had the starter on my old girl (1971 75/5) go out. BMW wanted 270 bucks to
_rebuild_ the old one. I went to a generator shop in downtown Pensacola and
he rebuilt it for 15 bucks, he even painted it (looked freaking new).. That
was 4 years ago and that starter still works.
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Rob Kleinschmidt

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Since: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 293



(Msg. 10) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 7:45 pm
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Mad Scientist wrote in message ...

  > >
  > >
  > > 12 volts is low for a battery. Are the battery terminals nice and clean?
  > > What's the system voltage when the bike runs?
  > >
  > > The starter could be rebuilt. You start with the brushes, which may need
  > > replacing. If you have to rewind the coils, then it may be worthwhile
  > > trying to find another one.
  > >
 >
 > Terminals are clean. At 3500rpm, there is 13.x volts at the battery.

The question is how much voltage do you see when the engine's stopped.
13.x volts just means your charging system's working. Doesn't mean
your battery is also holding the charge being pumped into it.

Also, there's a question of how clean and solid your positive and
negative connections are between the battery, starter and ground.

You probably should look at all of this before tearing into the
starter itself.
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Mad Scientist

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Since: Jul 07, 2003
Posts: 13



(Msg. 11) Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 11:54 pm
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Rob Kleinschmidt wrote:

 >
 >
   >>>
   >>>12 volts is low for a battery. Are the battery terminals nice and clean?
   >>>What's the system voltage when the bike runs?
   >>>
   >>>The starter could be rebuilt. You start with the brushes, which may need
   >>>replacing. If you have to rewind the coils, then it may be worthwhile
   >>>trying to find another one.
   >>>
  >>
  >>Terminals are clean. At 3500rpm, there is 13.x volts at the battery.
 >
 >
 > The question is how much voltage do you see when the engine's stopped.
 > 13.x volts just means your charging system's working. Doesn't mean
 > your battery is also holding the charge being pumped into it.
 >
 > Also, there's a question of how clean and solid your positive and
 > negative connections are between the battery, starter and ground.
 >
 > You probably should look at all of this before tearing into the
 > starter itself.

I did more tinkering last night. The connections are all clean. I
found that with the transmission in gear, if I manually turn the rear
wheel(which turns the engine which turns the armature inside the
starter), I can sometimes hit a point in the starter when it turn the
engine over. But it seems to be a crapshoot. Sometimes it works,
sometimes not. I'm thinking about swapping out the carbon brushes and
going from there.
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Rob Kleinschmidt

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Since: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 293



(Msg. 12) Posted: Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:39 pm
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Mad Scientist wrote in message ...
 > Rob Kleinschmidt wrote:

  > >
  > >
   > >>>
   > >>>12 volts is low for a battery. Are the battery terminals nice and clean?
   > >>>What's the system voltage when the bike runs?
   > >>>
   > >>>The starter could be rebuilt. You start with the brushes, which may need
   > >>>replacing. If you have to rewind the coils, then it may be worthwhile
   > >>>trying to find another one.
   > >>>
   > >>
   > >>Terminals are clean. At 3500rpm, there is 13.x volts at the battery.
  > >
  > >
  > > The question is how much voltage do you see when the engine's stopped.
  > > 13.x volts just means your charging system's working. Doesn't mean
  > > your battery is also holding the charge being pumped into it.
  > >
  > > Also, there's a question of how clean and solid your positive and
  > > negative connections are between the battery, starter and ground.
  > >
  > > You probably should look at all of this before tearing into the
  > > starter itself.
 >
 > I did more tinkering last night. The connections are all clean. I
 > found that with the transmission in gear, if I manually turn the rear
 > wheel(which turns the engine which turns the armature inside the
 > starter), I can sometimes hit a point in the starter when it turn the
 > engine over. But it seems to be a crapshoot. Sometimes it works,
 > sometimes not. I'm thinking about swapping out the carbon brushes and
 > going from there.

This doesn't make good sense to me. Normally a starter is not engaged
with the flywheel unless the solenoid is on. I don't think that turning
the engine would accomplish much. I don't think turning the engine or
wheel is turning the starter.

I'll also second the suggestion other folks have made that a 12 volt
reading with the engine not running is too low and indicates a battery
problem.

If you want to work on the starter, carbon brushes are a reasonable place
to start, but your battery should be reading 12.5 or so with the engine
not running before you look anywhere else for problems.

Good luck in your problem hunt.
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Margaret M.

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Since: Jul 13, 2003
Posts: 968



(Msg. 13) Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2004 5:08 am
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Mad Scientist wrote:
 > I've noticed my starter is getting progressively weaker to the

Dunno where you're located, but around the Houston area, the best guy
around for rebuilding starters, alternators, etc. is Jerry Reynolds at
Reynolds Battery Sales. He's rebuilt everything electrical on all my
vehicles back to my '65 Mustang. Reasonable price. So, yes,
Virginia, you can rebuild a starter. Smile
Mag
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